Black railworkers were instrumental in the early 1900s. A new exhibit tells their stories
Rondo Days co-founder Marvin Anderson photographed July 9, 2013 at Union Depot in Lowertown St. Paul. Behind Anderson, on the second floor overlooking the passenger waiting room, is the Red Cap Room. Anderson advocated for the name to recognize the Red Caps, the mostly African American station porters who welcomed passengers to St. Paul for more than 78 years.
Jennifer Simonson | MPR News
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Back in the day, traveling by train was elegant. It was a little slow, but you could see the scenery at a leisurely pace, have lunch or dinner in a dining car, and then perhaps retire to your own little room with a bed.
The people who helped who not only build the railroads but attended to the needs of passengers were Black. The Minnesota Transportation Museum is telling that story with a new exhibit opening this weekend. It’s called “Twin Tracks.”
As part of our North Star Journey series, MPR News host Cathy Wurzer spoke with Marvin Anderson. He is a curator for the exhibit and co-founder of Rondo Avenue, Inc., which is working to build a land bridge over I-94 in St. Paul to link up parts of the old Rondo neighborhood.
Use the audio player above to listen to the full conversation.
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Audio transcript
CATHY WURZER: Back in the day, traveling by train was elegant, a little slow, but you could see the scenery at a leisurely pace, have a little lunch or dinner in a dining car, and then perhaps retire to your own little room with a bed. The people who helped not only build the railroads but attended to the needs of passengers were Black. The Minnesota Transportation Museum is telling that story with a new exhibit opening this weekend. It's called "Twin Tracks."
As part of our North Star Journey series, Marvin Anderson joins us right now. Mr. Anderson is a curator for the exhibit. He is also co-founder of Rondo Avenue Inc, which is working to build a land bridge over I-94 in Saint Paul to link up parts of the old Rondo neighborhood.
Oh, Mr. Anderson, how have you been? It's been a long time since you and I have talked. Welcome back.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Thank you so much. It's good to be here with you again, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: You are used to getting things done. Previously, you led the way to getting a room in the Union Depot dedicated to Pullman porters. Can you explain why the porters were so important to the railroad?
MARVIN ANDERSON: Actually, the room at the Saint Paul Union Depot was in honor of the Red Caps, the gentlemen that would take your bag when you got out of your cab, your car, or the streetcar. These were the gentlemen that cut the grass, shoveled the snow, ran the elevators, in addition to all of their-- their main job, which was to make the passengers feel comfortable, make sure they got to their train on time, make visitors who came to Saint Paul-- tell them about Saint Paul.
They were called Saint Paul's "first ambassadors." That's back at the time when the Saint Paul Union Depot would have over 200 trains a day coming through. It was a very important station in railroad history, and the Red Caps were a part of that.
CATHY WURZER: So there were Red Caps, and then were there porters?
MARVIN ANDERSON: There's Red Caps. There's Pullman porters. There's chefs. There's waiters. And there are brakemen, people who worked-- firemen who worked outside of the train. What the Twin Tracks, our exhibit here at the Minnesota Transportation Museum, is doing is hiring the Red Cap when you walk in, the Pullman porter when you take your ticket, the chef who prepares your food, and the waiter who serves you food in the dining car. Those were predominantly African American men in the railroad for well over 130 years.
CATHY WURZER: Did you have family members who worked on the railroad?
MARVIN ANDERSON: I did. I am from a-- my grandfather was a porter under Great Northern Railroad out of Seattle, Washington. My father, who was transferred to Saint Paul with the Northern Pacific, was a waiter and a private car steward in that he would work for the president of the railroad when the president's private car was on a-- was on a trip. So, yeah, railroading is in my blood.
It goes back-- my grandfather started railroading when he was-- in the 1900s. He survived the third-worst railroad fatality crash. 95 people on the train that he was a porter died when a snow, like there's going on in the Cascade Mountains right now, an avalanche tipped over his car and another car. 95 people died and my grandfather survived that. And had not he survived, I would not be talking to you today, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: Right. Wow. That's a heck of a story. Another story, of course, since, as you pointed out, these folks were Black men, and these were-- these were difficult jobs. Their unionization in the 1920s was a huge milestone in American history. Does the exhibit--
MARVIN ANDERSON: Absolutely.
CATHY WURZER: --go into that? I'm betting it probably does.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Yeah, absolutely. I should add there were also African American women on the trains for a number of years. They were hired to babysit. They were hair stylists. And they were there to assist the women who needed help. So they traveled the train as well. And there will be a section of the African American women who rode the train as well.
But you're absolutely right, the porters and the waiters and the chefs in Minnesota and across the nation, they became the backbone of many communities, including Saint Paul and wherever you would have strong railroad travel. And their wages in the beginning were subpar. The railroads felt that they would get tips from their service.
The porter might get $0.05, $0.10 a bag. If he was lucky, he'd get a quarter. The Pullman porter would be given a tip. He would make the beds, shine shoes, attend to the needs of people who were in a sleeping car. A tip was left for the waiters in the dining car. And they would all kind of chip in and make sure that the chef got some of the tips. But until they unionized, those were sub-- they almost doubled their wages. They went from about $45 a month in the Union fight. And then they were able to get $80 a month, which was a big leap from there.
CATHY WURZER: Yeah, it was, but it still-- it was, again, a very difficult job. And I'm going to-- I'm going to assume there was a lot of discrimination on the job.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Oh, there was. There was discrimination, and there was an indignity as far as the porters were concerned. George Pullman, the man who actually designed and would build Pullman, these plush cars that were sleeper cars, he would hire a lot of the porters and he would lease them to a railroad. So you got the sleeper car, and you got the porter as well.
George Pullman had it in his mind that the white traveling customer would have a difficult time remembering an African American person's name. So he commanded that all porters who worked for him would be named "George." And there's a wonderful book called 10,000 Men Named George.
And that was the greatest indignity not to be able to use your name so that the customer would feel more comfortable. I don't know if that was true. But I do know that my grandfather would talk about the fact that not being able to be called your name was something that would get to his craw, as he called it.
CATHY WURZER: Mm-hmm. Does this new exhibit, by the way, include anything about the families of railroad workers because they also-- it was tough on them too?
MARVIN ANDERSON: Absolutely. Let me stress right now that this is the Reader Digest of exhibits. The Minnesota Transportation Museum has committed to expanding this exhibit. And if we don't have the female workers now, they'll be sure as the-- as this exhibit expands over the next years, you will see how it touched the families, who else was working on the railroad. It's going to be a marvelous exhibit.
But what we would like to do starting Saturday-- and then it is our hope that we can set up a direct link-- we want the descendants of people whose ancestor worked for the railroad to contact the Minnesota Transportation Museum and tell your story so that we know how working on the railroad affected them. We will have a better idea how it affected them and the role that was played by the people who were left behind, in a sense, for those five days. The standard run for a porter and a waiter and a chef was five days on the train, five days home, five days on the train, five days home.
During the time you were out on the railroad, things had to be done. And this is where this incredible experience of growing up in a community where working on the railroad was the primary job of Black Saint Paul. The railroad people were the number one employers.
Our mothers, our aunts, our grandmothers did all of the work. They would shovel the snow if you were too small. They would hammer. They would nail. They would form auxiliary groups. They got involved in civic affairs. And they planned events for the kids to go to. They were Scout leaders, Boy Scout leaders, Girl Scout leaders.
CATHY WURZER: They did a lot, obviously.
MARVIN ANDERSON: They did a lot. It had to be done.
CATHY WURZER: I wish I had more time with you. I always appreciate our conversations. Again, this is going to open up on Saturday.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Opens up Saturday at 11:00 at the Minnesota Transportation Museum, 193 Pennsylvania Avenue East. There will be refreshments. There will be a short train ride. And there'll be a tour of the exhibit itself. So we really hope that people come and help us build this story about the African American contribution to railroading in Minnesota. It's very important, and we need help.
CATHY WURZER: All right. Thank you, Marvin Anderson.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Always my pleasure, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: Likewise. This story was made possible in part by the Minnesota Legacy Amendments Arts and Cultural Heritage Fund. For more reporting on the North Star Journey series, go to mprnews.org.
As part of our North Star Journey series, Marvin Anderson joins us right now. Mr. Anderson is a curator for the exhibit. He is also co-founder of Rondo Avenue Inc, which is working to build a land bridge over I-94 in Saint Paul to link up parts of the old Rondo neighborhood.
Oh, Mr. Anderson, how have you been? It's been a long time since you and I have talked. Welcome back.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Thank you so much. It's good to be here with you again, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: You are used to getting things done. Previously, you led the way to getting a room in the Union Depot dedicated to Pullman porters. Can you explain why the porters were so important to the railroad?
MARVIN ANDERSON: Actually, the room at the Saint Paul Union Depot was in honor of the Red Caps, the gentlemen that would take your bag when you got out of your cab, your car, or the streetcar. These were the gentlemen that cut the grass, shoveled the snow, ran the elevators, in addition to all of their-- their main job, which was to make the passengers feel comfortable, make sure they got to their train on time, make visitors who came to Saint Paul-- tell them about Saint Paul.
They were called Saint Paul's "first ambassadors." That's back at the time when the Saint Paul Union Depot would have over 200 trains a day coming through. It was a very important station in railroad history, and the Red Caps were a part of that.
CATHY WURZER: So there were Red Caps, and then were there porters?
MARVIN ANDERSON: There's Red Caps. There's Pullman porters. There's chefs. There's waiters. And there are brakemen, people who worked-- firemen who worked outside of the train. What the Twin Tracks, our exhibit here at the Minnesota Transportation Museum, is doing is hiring the Red Cap when you walk in, the Pullman porter when you take your ticket, the chef who prepares your food, and the waiter who serves you food in the dining car. Those were predominantly African American men in the railroad for well over 130 years.
CATHY WURZER: Did you have family members who worked on the railroad?
MARVIN ANDERSON: I did. I am from a-- my grandfather was a porter under Great Northern Railroad out of Seattle, Washington. My father, who was transferred to Saint Paul with the Northern Pacific, was a waiter and a private car steward in that he would work for the president of the railroad when the president's private car was on a-- was on a trip. So, yeah, railroading is in my blood.
It goes back-- my grandfather started railroading when he was-- in the 1900s. He survived the third-worst railroad fatality crash. 95 people on the train that he was a porter died when a snow, like there's going on in the Cascade Mountains right now, an avalanche tipped over his car and another car. 95 people died and my grandfather survived that. And had not he survived, I would not be talking to you today, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: Right. Wow. That's a heck of a story. Another story, of course, since, as you pointed out, these folks were Black men, and these were-- these were difficult jobs. Their unionization in the 1920s was a huge milestone in American history. Does the exhibit--
MARVIN ANDERSON: Absolutely.
CATHY WURZER: --go into that? I'm betting it probably does.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Yeah, absolutely. I should add there were also African American women on the trains for a number of years. They were hired to babysit. They were hair stylists. And they were there to assist the women who needed help. So they traveled the train as well. And there will be a section of the African American women who rode the train as well.
But you're absolutely right, the porters and the waiters and the chefs in Minnesota and across the nation, they became the backbone of many communities, including Saint Paul and wherever you would have strong railroad travel. And their wages in the beginning were subpar. The railroads felt that they would get tips from their service.
The porter might get $0.05, $0.10 a bag. If he was lucky, he'd get a quarter. The Pullman porter would be given a tip. He would make the beds, shine shoes, attend to the needs of people who were in a sleeping car. A tip was left for the waiters in the dining car. And they would all kind of chip in and make sure that the chef got some of the tips. But until they unionized, those were sub-- they almost doubled their wages. They went from about $45 a month in the Union fight. And then they were able to get $80 a month, which was a big leap from there.
CATHY WURZER: Yeah, it was, but it still-- it was, again, a very difficult job. And I'm going to-- I'm going to assume there was a lot of discrimination on the job.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Oh, there was. There was discrimination, and there was an indignity as far as the porters were concerned. George Pullman, the man who actually designed and would build Pullman, these plush cars that were sleeper cars, he would hire a lot of the porters and he would lease them to a railroad. So you got the sleeper car, and you got the porter as well.
George Pullman had it in his mind that the white traveling customer would have a difficult time remembering an African American person's name. So he commanded that all porters who worked for him would be named "George." And there's a wonderful book called 10,000 Men Named George.
And that was the greatest indignity not to be able to use your name so that the customer would feel more comfortable. I don't know if that was true. But I do know that my grandfather would talk about the fact that not being able to be called your name was something that would get to his craw, as he called it.
CATHY WURZER: Mm-hmm. Does this new exhibit, by the way, include anything about the families of railroad workers because they also-- it was tough on them too?
MARVIN ANDERSON: Absolutely. Let me stress right now that this is the Reader Digest of exhibits. The Minnesota Transportation Museum has committed to expanding this exhibit. And if we don't have the female workers now, they'll be sure as the-- as this exhibit expands over the next years, you will see how it touched the families, who else was working on the railroad. It's going to be a marvelous exhibit.
But what we would like to do starting Saturday-- and then it is our hope that we can set up a direct link-- we want the descendants of people whose ancestor worked for the railroad to contact the Minnesota Transportation Museum and tell your story so that we know how working on the railroad affected them. We will have a better idea how it affected them and the role that was played by the people who were left behind, in a sense, for those five days. The standard run for a porter and a waiter and a chef was five days on the train, five days home, five days on the train, five days home.
During the time you were out on the railroad, things had to be done. And this is where this incredible experience of growing up in a community where working on the railroad was the primary job of Black Saint Paul. The railroad people were the number one employers.
Our mothers, our aunts, our grandmothers did all of the work. They would shovel the snow if you were too small. They would hammer. They would nail. They would form auxiliary groups. They got involved in civic affairs. And they planned events for the kids to go to. They were Scout leaders, Boy Scout leaders, Girl Scout leaders.
CATHY WURZER: They did a lot, obviously.
MARVIN ANDERSON: They did a lot. It had to be done.
CATHY WURZER: I wish I had more time with you. I always appreciate our conversations. Again, this is going to open up on Saturday.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Opens up Saturday at 11:00 at the Minnesota Transportation Museum, 193 Pennsylvania Avenue East. There will be refreshments. There will be a short train ride. And there'll be a tour of the exhibit itself. So we really hope that people come and help us build this story about the African American contribution to railroading in Minnesota. It's very important, and we need help.
CATHY WURZER: All right. Thank you, Marvin Anderson.
MARVIN ANDERSON: Always my pleasure, Cathy.
CATHY WURZER: Likewise. This story was made possible in part by the Minnesota Legacy Amendments Arts and Cultural Heritage Fund. For more reporting on the North Star Journey series, go to mprnews.org.
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